Thursday, April 03, 2008

What He Said...

Here’s a compelling essay about one of my VERY serious hot-buttons in life… Frugality, and its obverse, our spendthrift society… courtesy of The Art of Manliness. Excerpt:

I was once watching a TV show in which a round table of finance gurus were dispensing money advice to the studio audience. One of the advisors said that people should give up little luxuries like a daily Starbucks run and save and invest that money instead. A woman in the audience stood up and cried, “But what if I don’t want to give up Starbucks?” The crowed roared and clapped in approval.

The Founding Fathers feared such attitudes. They feared that too much luxury made a nation weak. They would often point to the Greeks and Romans as examples of what happens to a nation when it lets prosperity go unchecked by temperance and frugality. John Adams often preached against “effeminate luxuries.” And although wealthy, Ben Franklin lived a relatively simple life. He made an effort to eat and dress plainly.

Unfortunately, Americans have lost sight of the importance of frugality. For a generation of men who have grown up in a period of unprecedented affluence, living frugally seems down right silly and old fashion. But if a man wishes to remain economically and emotionally independent, frugality is an essential virtue to develop.

Why Being Frugal is Essential to Manning Up

(ed: and the essay continues from there…)

Brett, the blog’s author, emphasizes that frugality is essential to one’s independence… in the sense that debt enslaves you, taking away a lot (if not nearly all) of the choices in life. Brett’s argument is mostly couched in “manly” terms, but his advice applies to everyone…man, woman, or child.

My parents were children of The Great Depression, and as such, were very well-equipped to teach their children the value of being frugal. Nothing teaches us as well as experience, be it personal or anecdotal. I use “anecdotal” in the sense that my father, while never destitute, saw enough destitution in pre-war (WW II) Detroit to fully appreciate what being destitute meant. There are damned few among us today that learned that lesson first-hand, and those that DID learn it won’t be with us all that much longer. So…it’s understandable, perhaps, that our instant-gratification, No-Money-Down!, Bad-Credit?-NOT-a-Problem!, society is out there on a rather thin limb.

Some of us, anyway. The thing that pisses me right off is the spendthrifts will take the rest of us down when that limb breaks. I’m not the first person to say this, but a LOT of our current financial crisis is due to the fact people bit off more… a LOT more… than they could chew. Who, in their right mind, would willingly take on a mortgage they KNOW they can’t afford? And the same thing goes for cars big-ass SUVs, boats, swimming pools, so on and so forth.

It’s waaay past time for us to Man Up…financially speaking.

(h/t: Mike…who tipped me to The Art of Manliness, but not about the frugality bits. Mike was on about pocket knives, and he was right about that.)

17 comments:

  1. You know, we may josh back and forth about hockey and football, but I couldn't agree with you more on this topic. One of the things that gets under my skin is those who say, "You just can't survive on one income these days!" Well, yeah you can. I've been doing it my whole adult life.

    Ah, don't get me started...

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  2. Kudos to you Buck! I agree with you wholeheartedly. Especially young people, they believe they need (or should have) new homes and new cars. When I was newly married I was happy just to have a house, and if the car started it was a good car.

    We were just discussing (at art) children are being overstimulated with having to much, which brings discontentment with everything and they want more. This is the same thing happening in American. Lack of restraint, constantly seeking more. Must be satisfied at all cost.

    Do i sound old and cranky?? LOL

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  3. When it comes to the big ticket items, buy what you can afford even in the worst of times. That's something that few people practice anymore.

    It's all about personal responsibility. What really frosts me is the gov't. may well help bail out the asshats who insisted on getting themselves a variable rate mortgage for their mcmansion. Um, what about variable did they not understand???

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  4. You guys got my 100% agreement too!
    This is really something that grieves me not just the flagrant spending but that very "I've just got to have my Starbucks" mentality.
    We raised 8 children on one salary. I can't even look at someone who gripes about trying to make it now days with only 2 children and two jobs, without feeling great pity.

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  5. I completely agree also. I call it keeping up with the Jones' syndrome. People do not see the value of money. I wrote a rant about this several weeks ago but did not post it. Maybe I should see if i can find it.

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  6. I was going to say that, but Old and Cranky, I mean Junk Diva beat me to it.

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  7. Well said Buck. I feel like smacking people when they say that they so wish that they could live on one income but can't (as they drive off in their new BMW SUV or Escalade). There is no way that I could keep up with the Joneses around here, so I don't even try.

    I feel like an old timer when I see young adults that refuse to live in a crummy apartment or drive an old car so they can save for something else. You should have seen then crummy places I lived and the cars... if I had one.

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  8. I remember, Make it, Find it, Forget it. Frugal days of the depression. Nice post and interesting.

    I will comment more at another time as I just returned from hospital and am not back to normal.

    Abraham Lincoln in Brookville, Ohio.

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  9. This is so true! I watch people who have things they should not be able to afford and wonder when the crash will come... and who will have to pick up the pieces. I just know I will be punished for their behavior...

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  10. Hey, I linked to the frugality bit! I just didn't highlight it as prominently as I did the pocket knife piece.

    In theory, I agree with you on how frugality is overlooked in today's society. Of course, I'm guilty of occasionally violating that standard, but I only do it to by "useful" things, like knives, or guns, or power tools. My biggest problem is that I won't buy anything other than top of the line name brand, because to me anything else is a poor investment. The downside to that is you end up spending $100 on a DeWalt as opposed to $25 on a cheap asian knockoff.

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  11. Buck:

    I don't usually flog my own blog here (and doesn't that sounf Freudian...) but todays' entry concerns an episode from the depression with my grandfather. I think you'll enjoy it.

    http://jimsuldog.blogspot.com/2008/04/pa-big-fish.html

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  12. Becky sez: You know, we may josh back and forth about hockey and football, but I couldn't agree with you more on this topic.

    Joshing? Who's joshing? I'm deadly serious! (JUST kidding!) I hear ya bout the one income thing...as do other folks.

    Diva sez: Lack of restraint, constantly seeking more. Must be satisfied at all cost. ... Do i sound old and cranky?? LOL

    Not at all. We're on the same page, and if that's "old and cranky," then I'm guilty as charged, as well.

    Wait. I AM old and cranky... Who am I trying to kid? ;-)

    Krsi sez: It's all about personal responsibility. What really frosts me is the gov't. may well help bail out the asshats who insisted on getting themselves a variable rate mortgage for their mcmansion.

    It IS all about personal responsibility, innit? I think you can be sure the gub'mint is gonna develop some sort of bail-out for the "can't read a contract" crowd.

    Dawn sez: You guys got my 100% agreement too!
    This is really something that grieves me not just the flagrant spending but that very "I've just got to have my Starbucks" mentality.
    We raised 8 children on one salary. I can't even look at someone who gripes about trying to make it now days with only 2 children and two jobs, without feeling great pity.


    I don't have an issue with people wanting their Starbucks... coz I'm one of them, as long-time readers know (well, I USED to be, when I lived where there are Starbucks stores). I generally don't have a problem with anyone wanting and/or buying luxury or discretionary items, as long as they can afford it, which also means corners aren't cut and the savings are tended regularly and often.

    I admire you and Shaun and what you guys have done, Dawn. You two are a real positive example for others.

    Ashley sez: I wrote a rant about this several weeks ago but did not post it. Maybe I should see if i can find it.

    DO, Ashley! The more the merrier where this issue is concerned!

    Lou sez: I was going to say that, but Old and Cranky, I mean Junk Diva beat me to it.

    Play nice! ;-)

    Susan sez: There is no way that I could keep up with the Joneses around here, so I don't even try.

    I feel like an old timer when I see young adults that refuse to live in a crummy apartment or drive an old car so they can save for something else. You should have seen then crummy places I lived and the cars... if I had one.


    You live in the Heart of Darkness where this issue is concerned, Susan (IMHO). Please excuse my SoCal bashing, but as someone who was raised in the Mid-West, I'm sure you know what I mean. And I certainly hear ya about crummy apartments and old cars. I had plenty of experience with that stuff as a junior enlisted guy. With children.

    Abe sez: I will comment more at another time as I just returned from hospital and am not back to normal.

    I'm glad you're home, Abe. I've been following Patty's updates on you...and this is a great good thing. Take it EASY!

    Cynthia sez: This is so true! I watch people who have things they should not be able to afford and wonder when the crash will come...

    I resisted the temptation to rant on more than I did in this post, not addressing credit card debt, for one thing.

    Mike sez: Hey, I linked to the frugality bit! I just didn't highlight it as prominently as I did the pocket knife piece.

    In theory, I agree with you on how frugality is overlooked in today's society. Of course, I'm guilty of occasionally violating that standard, but I only do it to by "useful" things, like knives, or guns, or power tools. My biggest problem is that I won't buy anything other than top of the line name brand...


    Yes, you did. My bad, and my apologies. I think buying "quality" is a good idea, generally speaking. There are some exceptions, but they're rare. Once again...it all comes down to what one can afford. There's no reason to go all the way out on that limb to buy a BMW Z-4 convertible when a Miata does 90% of what the Beemer does at half the price. (Cheesy example, I know: who really NEEDS a convertible? No one.)

    Jim sez: I don't usually flog my own blog here (and doesn't that sounf Freudian...)

    No need to flog on my account, Jim, as you're one of my daily reads. Others will appreciate the link. At least they should, LOL!

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  13. Yeah, that's a good way of putting it, Buck. There's quality, where you're getting a solid product, and then there's quality, where you're paying a 15% markup just for the name on it. I'm perfectly content buying the first option, it's just that even that much is a stretch right now. I'm sure I'll be fine once I get out in the real world, but right now I'm like to live an LT lifestyle on a non-scholarship cadet's salary. :-p Unfortunately, that's just not gonna happen.

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  14. I don't have an issue with people wanting their Starbucks... coz I'm one of them, as long-time readers know (well, I USED to be, when I lived where there are Starbucks stores). I generally don't have a problem with anyone wanting and/or buying luxury or discretionary items, as long as they can afford it, which also means corners aren't cut and the savings are tended regularly and often.
    I agree with that Buck, I apologize for maybe coming off a little arrogant there, cause I'm certainly not against wanting Starbucks or other luxeries ( Lord knows we have them!), I suppose I was directing that comment to the ones who chose those things over the more important things such as paying off their debts!
    Thanks for clearing that up :)

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  15. The thing that pisses me right off is the spendthrifts will take the rest of us down when that limb breaks I’m not the first person to say this, but a LOT of our current financial crisis is due to the fact people bit off more… a LOT more… than they could chew. Who, in their right mind, would willingly take on a mortgage they KNOW they can’t afford?

    One needn't look any further than than the 10 foreclosed houses w/in a 1-mile radius. And we're not talking McMansions either. Rather bunches of folks got greedy, jumped on the prime market then built swimming pools and bought boats and RVs with the home "equity" loans off the hyper-inflated real estate market here in NoVa. Then the market went pfft, they suddenly realized they had a mountain of unaffordable debt and the rest of us are stuck with devalued property. Of course there was also some really unethical mortgage brokerage work that went on too (and ought to result in jail sentences)

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  16. Good, good post, Buck.
    Like so many others, we have spendthrift friends, too. It is not just young people, middle age and even those approaching elderly do the same thing.
    Some years back, my father, who had weathered the Great Depression told me how had stood in a line to get a free meal with tears running down his cheeks because he had to ask for help from a charity.
    I have never forgotten.

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  17. Mike sez: I'm perfectly content buying the first option, it's just that even that much is a stretch right now.

    This, too, shall pass. Just hang in there...ya gots "the Right Stuff," Mike.

    SJS sez: One needn't look any further than than the 10 foreclosed houses w/in a 1-mile radius. And we're not talking McMansions either. Rather bunches of folks got greedy, jumped on the prime market then built swimming pools and bought boats and RVs with the home "equity" loans off the hyper-inflated real estate market here in NoVa. Then the market went pfft...

    Precisely, SJS. I feel your pain, too, and I'm not being flip. I may have blogged about my disgust with all the Ditech "Refinance! Now!" ads in the past (but I'm too lazy to look it up). Declining home values hurt the conscientious just as much, perhaps more... if one includes the psychic pain, as they hurt the irresponsible.

    I was caught in the great Oklahoma/Texas oil patch real estate collapse back in 1985, and I took a $6K check to closing when I SOLD my house. The collapsing market wiped out my equity, and this was back in the days of 20% down... But: I was danged glad to get out from underneath the house, in any case. It took me a year to finally find a buyer. That was painful.

    Cat sez: Some years back, my father, who had weathered the Great Depression told me how had stood in a line to get a free meal with tears running down his cheeks because he had to ask for help from a charity.
    I have never forgotten.


    As I mentioned in the post, my father told me similar stories. I, too, haven't forgotten.

    Thanks for the kind words, as well.

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Just be polite... that's all I ask.