tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18232353.post6571097545485760440..comments2023-12-27T13:35:09.431-07:00Comments on Exile in Portales: Conservatives, Liberals, and Libertarians... Oh My!Buckhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/05319116022465066060noreply@blogger.comBlogger11125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18232353.post-21489825548206414602009-10-29T19:43:36.178-06:002009-10-29T19:43:36.178-06:00I agree with you on Newt Gingrich, Buck. He's...I agree with you on Newt Gingrich, Buck. He's an ideas man, but I wouldn't want him running for office again.Gordon Scotthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16772014586181361069noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18232353.post-30691586184976920222009-10-29T12:41:18.549-06:002009-10-29T12:41:18.549-06:00Lou: I know you're right on the social issue ...Lou: I <i>know</i> you're right on the social issue thing, but I think it depends on how strident the social conservatives become. <i>I'LL</i> break from the GOP if they go too far. Which makes me wonder: are we that far from anarchy?<br /><br />Alison: You're right, of course. Most conservatives in the US are pissed at the Left for having <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Classical_liberal" rel="nofollow">co-opted the term</a>. I like to call 'em "moonbats," myself. :p<br /><br />Clay: Thanks for dropping by. Unfortunately, I think only a tiny fraction of Dems are leaning to wards their roots.<br /><br />Gordon (& Jimmy): Yup: the smaller the election, the better the chance for a third-party candidate. I think NY23... or any US House district... is about as large a constituency that can support a third party, unless and until you talk about really small states like Rhode Island or Connecticut (think Ol' Joe).<br /><br />I agree with both you and Jimmy that there's quite a bit of dissatisfaction with the GOP these days and messages most certainly ARE being sent. The big question(s): are the messages being received? And what's going to be done about it?<br /><br />I like Newt, Jimmy. He's one of the few serious thinkers in the GOP today. Morally handicapped, true, but politically astute and correct (in the GOOD way) for the most part.Buckhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05319116022465066060noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18232353.post-56916964518945464792009-10-29T06:48:28.830-06:002009-10-29T06:48:28.830-06:00Buck,
I agree with you on the 3ard party issue as ...Buck,<br />I agree with you on the 3ard party issue as I do think it pulls voters from the R-side in most cases (look at the NJ Gubernatorial race where the Republican would be in a runaway race except for the third party candidate who may or may not be running as a surrogate for the Democrat candidate for the sole purpose of pulling those vote away from the Republican) but in this race there is a big chance that the Conservative candidate can pull this off and the value here is the message it sends to the RNC. It is time for some soul searching in that august body and since they are not listening to the tea party public, they need to get their “pee-pee” spanked, what not a better way than by having them get this election stuck straight up their noses. We need to have the Republican Party re-vitalized much the same way it was when Carter was president, it was what Ragan called for, not surrender like Newt.<br /><br />BT: Jimmy T sendsJimmyThttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00595473108896212170noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18232353.post-47424566059982135152009-10-28T21:40:39.844-06:002009-10-28T21:40:39.844-06:00I think what's happening in NY-23 is symptomat...I think what's happening in NY-23 is symptomatic of what a lot of folks are thinking. I agree with you, Buck, on the concept of A Third Party. It won't work, nationwide.<br /><br />But it can work in some places, sometimes. In this case, the party bosses got together and anointed someone that conservatives/libertarians couldn't stomach. Hoffman stepped up, and they are flocking to him.<br /><br />He's said he will caucus with the Republicans in DC, and will seek the Republican endorsement next year. I think this is similar to the situation with the Florida US senate seat.<br /><br />The folks I talk to are done with eastern elites, no matter which party.Gordon Scotthttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16772014586181361069noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18232353.post-86825768570978856222009-10-28T17:31:01.687-06:002009-10-28T17:31:01.687-06:00Do we see some Democrats leaning back to their 19t...Do we see some Democrats leaning back to their 19th century founders, like Jefferson to Jackson, instead of following Rousseau and Marx, as we see with Obama and Pelosi? This is cited in THE CHANGING FACE OF DEMOCRATS on Amazon and www.claysamerica.com. IThose founding Democrats were the first libertarians, and many may be attracted to go back to those good ol' days.Clay Barhamhttp://www.claysamerica.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18232353.post-81393404430384033922009-10-28T17:10:00.497-06:002009-10-28T17:10:00.497-06:00Liberal means old fashioned liberal (libertarianis...Liberal means old fashioned liberal (libertarianish) as opposed to big government big state leftwingers. I think you guys say liberal overall for the Left.alisonnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18232353.post-40655022678125476252009-10-28T15:09:49.424-06:002009-10-28T15:09:49.424-06:00Three's a crowd. But people who think social i...Three's a crowd. But people who think social issues are important are pretty adamant about it. They want a party who supports their views. I can see it becoming a decisive issue.Bag Bloghttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01885412195900280096noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18232353.post-63247471340077281762009-10-28T12:26:02.908-06:002009-10-28T12:26:02.908-06:00Alison sez: Liberal and libertarian have been syn...Alison sez: <i>Liberal and libertarian have been synonymous here ...</i><br /><br />Not so here... they are two entirely different animals. Our libs are very Big Government, libertarians are the exact opposite. Libertarians are generally ALL about small government and personal choice/responsibility. There's a lot to like there. I fall out with the Libertarians when it comes to foreign policy, as Big "L" libertarians tend to be isolationists... and I'm not.<br /><br />Jimmy: As I said... I have NO idea what's going on in NY-23, only what I read. But I don't like this movement towards Third Parties, as I'm of the belief it cedes power and control to the Dems... and THAT'S NOT good for the country. We can (maybe) stand four years of The One... I dunno about eight.<br /><br />Darryl: Newt does have some pretty heavy personal baggage, this is true. But he is one of the real "idea men" in the GOP. And thanks for the link.Buckhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05319116022465066060noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18232353.post-76920816122798332982009-10-28T11:41:51.956-06:002009-10-28T11:41:51.956-06:00Hey Buck,
Newt Gingrich is a smart cat, but I don&...Hey Buck,<br />Newt Gingrich is a smart cat, but I don't care for his sense of honor. Just like I can salute John McCain for his service to our Nation, but don't consider McCain a conservative.<br /><br />I choose my own way and vote thusly. No carpet baggers are needed to help guide me along.<br /><br /><br />P.S. If you haven't already, read this link (written in 1937!)http://www.pagebypagebooks.com/Ayn_Rand/Anthem/ and tell me we aren't today sliding down the path to collectivism?Barco Sin Vela IIhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15621907771132379553noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18232353.post-77119178788416196412009-10-28T06:24:26.779-06:002009-10-28T06:24:26.779-06:00Buck,
I find fault with Newt's assertion that ...Buck,<br />I find fault with Newt's assertion that the "local" party knows best. I have seen it here first hand and know that the people who do the endorsing locally are all in the business of politics for reasons that have nothing to do with Country wide politics. I think this is where Newt if mistaken; a Congress person will affect the country at a federal level, not at a local street corner level. Those endorsement committees are in it for themselves not for the larger Country. Again, I have seen it first hand, the lying and personal smears only because you disagree with a Party Boss on say, Zoning of a parcel they own (real case), or with another Party Boss because you challenge the way the screw the Township or County out of money (yes another real instance) or another Party elitists on the use of a park near his property (yeah, another real case). All of these people are polled to endorse candidates for election, it is why PA has the poster Boy of RINO’s, Arlen Specter for so many years. And I suspect this is the reason why the local Party up there in northern New York picked the RINO instead of looking around and thinking outside their immediate confines for an appropriate candidate. I hope this Hoffman guy beats them all. <br /><br />BT: Jimmy T sends.JimmyThttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00595473108896212170noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-18232353.post-35209715328404080072009-10-28T05:03:48.600-06:002009-10-28T05:03:48.600-06:00Very interesting summary of the political issue du...Very interesting summary of the political issue du jour your side of the Pond. thanks. I hadn't understood what was going on with this really. Sounds like you guys are now about where we were with Thatcher.<br /><br />Not sure what I think of libertarian politics. Liberal and libertarian have been synonymous here and brought about the libertine social hues we have colouring society commercially to such a massive degree that it is influencing our society. But under libertarian politocs you cannot say anything about it else you are anti freedoms. <br /><br />We have always tended to the conservative here. Legislation was clearly and rightfully balancing a conservative society with personal freedoms. Thatcher and Enoch Powell, political heroes of mine both voted for abortion and divorce legislation I am happy to say. Thatcher gave a good speech on this issue. I accept that there is a balance to be struck and debate around these points but I would hate to have politics where there is a litmus test of the kind mentioned in your post. Scozzafava sounds like Thatcher. Small government, low taxes, legislative balance on social concerns.<br /><br />So if Thatcher, Powell and Scozzafava define my politics as lib I would be very surprised.alisonnoreply@blogger.com